Welcome And Series Setup

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Hi, and welcome to our podcast, Revelation Within on the Go. I'm Heidi Miles MaEpherson, one of your hosts, and the owner and lead coach of the Revelation Within Ministry.

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And I'm Christina Motley, your other host, also a Revelation Within coach, and Heidi's partner in all things Revelation Within. And we are so happy to invite you to join us for this episode of Revelation Within.

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We're kind of doing a series called Loud Longings Holy God. And it's kind of reflective of what we went through in one of our monthly themes and also what we are doing with one of our coaching groups. And so we don't want anybody to miss it. It's so good. It's so good. Boy, I mean, I've been working through the workbook as well, and it's just touching my heart. That sounds so silly to say about something that I had a hand in creating, but it's like for me, that's when I know it's something God wants to use in my life, certainly, is if I had a hand in writing it or putting it together at all. I mean, and the thing with Inbook was like that too. I I God still used it to touch my heart and still does anytime I pick it up and look at it. Anyway, so if you've been with us for the previous episodes, we have talked about all kinds of interesting things. I really think that this takes us deep, um, even if we don't want to. Right.

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Yes, and I can relate to that.

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Yeah, me too. We've been talking about

Longings Comfort And False Salvation

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longings that we have, memory, and how food often carries some of our stories with it. Um, the parts of ourselves that reach for comfort. Is it the lonely part? Is it the the dejected part, the childlike part? Um, and the ways that our hearts can quietly begin kind of looking to smaller things for salvation. Now, salvation is in quotes, but in the moment when I'm looking for a way out, I'm looking for anything to give me an escape. Yes. So, yeah, I mean, can you relate to that? I know you can my partner in quick.

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Yes, yes, you know all my stories, Heidi and I can relate.

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Today we're moving into something deeply important, and it and it really is. We're talking about everybody's favorite topic.

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I'm kidding.

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Surrender. Somebody in one of our classes told us that her word of the year for umpteen years has been surrender. And I love I love that honesty.

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Yeah, I too.

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But before we start tensing up at the thought of talking about this, or before you do, um, let's just acknowledge that really the truth about surrender is it can feel like a loaded word.

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Yeah, yes.

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Yeah. For some of us, it sounds

Surrender Feels Loaded

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beautiful, it sounds freeing, it sounds peaceful. And for others, it sounds frightening and costly. Um, but today we want to think God's thoughts about surrender and look at surrender through the eyes of Jesus. And that's a good place to be.

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That's a good place to be. I like starting there. Okay, so before we begin, let's slow down together a little bit. So let's go ahead and take a deep breath and just exhale that out nice and slow. Okay, we're gonna do a little breath prayer here just to kind of get us started. You are the strength of my heart, and then and my portion forever.

Breath Prayer And Psalm 73

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So let's go ahead and inhale. You are the strength of my heart and exhale and my portion forever. Let's do that again. Nice deep breath. You are the strength of my heart and breathe out, and my portion forever. Breathe in. You are the strength of my heart and breathe out. And my portion forever. Okay. Oh, that's wonderful. That feels so good, doesn't it? Just to do just to do a breath prayer. It's like it calms me down in every way, physically, emotionally. It's like, okay, now I'm ready. So today today's scripture comes from Psalm 73, verses 25 and 26. Whom have I in heaven but you? And there is nothing on earth that I desired besides you. My flesh and my heart may fail, but God is the strength of my heart and my portion forever. I love that the psalmist here doesn't pretend strength. Right. You know, pretending is kind of one of my things, one of my struggles. I love that he doesn't pretend strength. He doesn't say, my heart never struggles. He doesn't say, my emotions never fail, my desires are always perfectly aligned. No, he doesn't say any of that. It would, we'd be like, Oh, no. Instead, he says, My flesh and my heart may fail, but God remains. Jesus remains. Oh, I love that.

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It's interesting to me that word fail jumps off of the page in the scriptures anytime it shows up. For me, it

Why Surrender Is So Hard

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does. My flesh and my heart may fail. But God is the strength of my heart and my portion forever. I love that. That's just that's one of my favorite psalms. Well, one thing I've noticed over years of ministry is that many of us assume surrender should feel easy if we love God enough. Yes, that is so true.

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That is so true, isn't it? Oh my gosh.

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Yeah, and honestly, that hasn't been my experience. I know all kinds of people who love God a lot. Yes. Surrender is still a struggle. And I don't really think it's necessarily what we see in scripture either. Surrender often feels difficult because the reality is we're letting go of something that may have helped us cope. Cope with life, coped with stress, coped with all kinds of difficult things in our lives. For instance, food, of course, may have helped, and control may have helped. Yep. Planning, you know, I'm gonna be an ultra planner.

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Let's make a plan.

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Yes, and busyness, I've used that before. I've got to stay busy so I can cope and control my life. Scrolling may have you know helped in some way, maybe not deeply and maybe not permanently, but all of these things have helped us get through difficult moments. Yes, and when Jesus invites us to trust him instead, there can be fear for sure.

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Oh, I think that is such an important distinction because many people judge themselves when surrender feels hard. I have done that a million times. You've judged yourself, yes. It's like I should be able to surrender easily. Why can't I surrender easily after all these years of practicing and and trying and praying and renewing my mind and and and and and and and you know, why is surrender still difficult at times? Um, a lot of us think if I were just more spiritual, um, this wouldn't be so difficult. Or I've heard people say more spiritually mature. Yeah, you know, like I'm just not I'm just not mature even after all these years, you know, and it's like, wait a minute. Um, or we might say, if I really trusted God, I wouldn't struggle so much. But maybe the struggle isn't proof that we're failing. Maybe we have that completely wrong. Maybe it's proof that something important is being reordered.

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Hmm.

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What do you think about that, Heidi?

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Oh, thinking, thinking, thinking.

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Let's talk about something that we don't often discuss, and that is the things that are attached to surrender

Grief Hiding Inside Letting Go

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for us so very often. I mean, in a very real way, surrender often includes grief. Boy, does it, does it ever? I mean, I remember vividly when I was first trying to deal with my eating issues, and I instead of dieting, I had made the break from dieting. This was eons ago. This was in uh probably 1999 or so, maybe 2000. And there was grief. I wanted to be hungry because I knew I could eat when I was hungry, and I remember feeling sad that I wasn't hungry. I wanted to surrender, but I was frustrated that I needed to surrender all the many times I would reach for food when I wasn't hungry. And that was just one that I mean, that's the easiest one that came to the top of my head. Can you think of an instance when you connected maybe early on surrender with grief, Christina?

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The moment that you said the grief is connected with surrender, I thought about people that I've lost, people that have passed on and how how hard that was and how hard it is to surrender. Or also what came to mind were things that I've lost, like for example, um, a job that I loved, a career, you know, when I had to switch careers, or my health when my health went sideways, you know, things like that. I was thinking about loss in that way. Um because all of a sudden you feel like you've been hit. You know, it's like, oh man, I didn't see this coming. This is so hard. And then it's for me at least, I pulled back my surrender and I say, Whoa, I'm I'm gonna hold on to this tighter because this other thing was taken away. I don't know. Does that make sense?

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Yeah, it does. Um, I think an important distinction is probably that when we are surrendering, it's something we have volition, we have a choice. Yes, and and it makes it really complicated. And and for me, especially if I've been dealing with a lot of imposed surrender, like what you were talking about, like loss and grief for other reasons, you know, imposed on me, like by somebody leaving a relationship with me or losing an animal, you know, or that sounds silly.

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But no, that doesn't sound silly at all. That's a that's a deep grief.

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But there's no doubt that surrender includes grief, and it's sometimes not because we're losing something good, and it's not because God is necessarily taking something precious away, but because we're releasing something familiar, and and familiar things really have a spot in our lives. For me, as a person who was raised in an abusive home, um, things that aren't familiar usually have negative connotations. It means I'm not safe or whatever. My nervous system has a hard time with the unfamiliar. Um, and so I have to really slow down, invite God in and work with him. And so when I am choosing to surrender, I'm releasing something familiar, something that I have felt safe with. And food

Familiar Coping Control And Safety

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has often been there when people weren't reliable for me. Um, so that is a tough one. And control for me, if I can predict what is going to happen by being more controlling, and I hate to say that, but even people pleasing is a form of controlling. So by being it doesn't necessarily come across as being a nasty mean person. Sometimes we can be someone who just wants to please everybody because then they're controllable. If I know I'm gonna make you happy, then life is good and predictable. But um, control of any kind may have felt safer than uncertainty. I know it has for me. Um, and achievements, those may have felt safer than vulnerability. If I can get accolades and put my trophies on a shelf, I can or wear the t-shirt that says I completed the marathon. That sounds silly, but it I I end up feeling safer than if I'm just floating along. Yeah, yeah. And how about you? Can you relate to any of those, Christina? Um, not the marathon one.

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5K, that's fine. I did a five, yeah, I've done a few 5K's. That's all in my past, though. I don't think my body wants to do that anymore. Oh, mine either. Um, but yeah, no, sometimes, yeah, accomplishments feel like, okay, you know, I've still got it somehow. Or like, somehow I'm okay. Like, you know, I still have a brain that works. I don't know. It does, it makes you feel sometimes like um secure, but it's temporary, you know, because then if there's something you don't do well, it's like, oh man, now I'm not now I'm feeling the opposite of secure. Right. Yeah, going back to familiar things that often feel safe. I mean familiar things in terms of a relationship that's strong. And then suddenly there's a struggle there, and it's like, I feel like I'm falling apart, like my whole world is is shaking. Or things that feel safe. For example, you know, I mentioned uh, you know, getting news about your health. It's like, oh, I thought I was fine. I feel fine. Wait a minute, I have this diagnosis. I didn't even know that anything was wrong. That is like earth shattering. It shakes us. Yeah, and it's hard to surrender and say, okay, Lord, I trust you with whatever you're gonna bring. Bring it on. And what's that? Where's that verse where it says, I laugh at the future?

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I think it's Proverbs 31, actually.

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Yeah, it's it is, it's the where it describes the Proverbs 31 woman, right? Yes. And it's like, I have never ever been at a point where I can laugh at the future, maybe when I was 21. I don't know. It's just, I think that, you know, as things happen to us more and more, and to those that we love, sometimes it's hard to trust God. It's like, what's gonna happen next? When I surrender, I feel so much better. I do. I feel good, I feel peaceful. All of the weight of the burden sits on God's shoulders instead of mine. And I love the way that feels, yeah, but I can easily slip out of that and be in a place of, you know what, I'll take this one, Lord, because well, you know what happened last time. Right?

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Definitely. I know for me that during the most painful seasons of my life,

Vulnerability After Loss And Illness

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busyness was something I turned to to protect me from feeling the pain. Oh my goodness, when my husband at the time moved out and wanted to be separated for a season, supposedly. Anyway, I did something every night to stay away from home because those were the hours I associated with connection with him. We would always hang out together and do things. So I would go to this Bible study or that support group or this friend's house or every single night of the week. Seriously. And yeah. And then uh when I wasn't going to some sort of meeting of some kind away from home, I would be sure I had a long task list I could return to. Um, when I lived on this quaint little farm in Garden Valley, we called Charlotte's Rem Farm.

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Oh, I love that little farm.

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I I was really busy. I had all kinds of stuff I was doing. Yeah. And so to actually intentionally surrender busyness because God's calling me to it, so maybe so I can attend to what's going on in my heart, like he was at that time. When I loosen my grip on those things, I'm gonna experience grief, and I probably will experience the pain that is a part of whatever it is I've been running from. There's a big sense of loss and a sense of exposure, and of course, vulnerability. Oh, if you've ever felt that you're not strange, you're not strange for human. Yeah, you mentioned recently that you have a kind of a fear of driving, that there's a sense of vulnerability. You feel like everybody's gonna hit you. I just have to tell you that I get that, I totally get it. Ever since 2014, for me, I have been way less confident about being out and about. I mean, I live usually in somewhat remote areas, it seems like, and you know, canyon roads and windy roads. Yes, you do. And I get it. Once we have been hit by a surprise, like you were with cancer, and like I was with the staph infection that impacted my spine so much. Oh my gosh, I think we realize we are not invincible, that there is a vulnerability that's normal and human, but we never experienced it before. Right.

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Not to that level. Well, and I feel vulnerable about other people too, you know, like I'm more concerned about my kids. Um, maybe, oh, you're gonna you're gonna travel. Oh, um, you know, like I'm thinking about like my my daughter is planning this really big trip to go see her friend, and it's gonna be a huge journey by herself to see her friend. And there's gonna be some time where she has to navigate everything by herself, including hotels and places she doesn't know. And, you know, she could tell that I was really concerned about that. So last night she was telling me some of the things that she has put in place so that she will be safe and that I don't have to worry. But it's true, you know, being hit with breast cancer, something that I never, ever, ever imagined that I would get. And I felt fine when I was diagnosed, absolutely fine, right? And so it seemed like there was no warning, it just kind of came. And then it was a year-long process to deal with it. And I'm at the very end, I'm in the last few weeks of this year-long process right now. But then there's always going to be appointments and checks and things like that. But during during those really sick months for me when I was doing chemo and even radiation, I just let everybody else drive. You know, I everybody else drove me around. And I thought that was great. I mean, I wasn't feeling well, so it makes sense. But then when I was feeling better and it was time to get behind the wheel, I was looking around like everybody's gonna hit me, like you said. And I it surprised me because I've I've always been a confident driver. I've always been a relaxed driver, like not anxious or upset or anything, or getting upset with other people. On the road, I've always been very patient, kind of like a grandma driver. Um, anyway, so I've had to start driving little by little again and kind of drive in areas that aren't so busy and tell myself the truth. I'm fine. God is with me.

Waiting For God Alone

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I'm driving. If something happens, we'll deal with it. Chances are nothing will happen. You know, I'm not alone, things like that. And it's really been something that I just never expected. You know, so many of us might assume that experiencing grief means that. We're moving in the wrong direction. But often grief simply means that something is changing. Something that once sat on the throne is being moved. Something that was once a certain way, and we kind of depended on it to be that way and not to change is changing. Jesus is inviting us into something deeper.

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I love that. I love that he is so mindful of that and he's calling us to go deeper still. Psalm 62 reminds us for God alone, my soul waits in silence. I don't know about you, but um, waiting feels very different from grabbing. Yes. I want that, and I want that, and I want that. Yeah, feels very different from controlling. It does. And when an urge rises up inside of me and inside of you, everything inside of us may want immediate relief. Yeah, immediate comfort, immediate certainty. Take this away. But Jesus often invites relationship before relief.

Jesus In Gethsemane As Our Model

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Oh, I love that you said that, Heidi. Relationship before relief, yes.

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And really, that's where surrender begins. Not in perfection, not in performance, but in trust.

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Yeah, wow. So when I think about surrender, I think about Jesus in the Garden of Gethsemane. Because Jesus never asks us to walk a road that he hasn't walked himself. Luke tells us that Jesus was in deep anguish. Matthew tells us that he was sorrowful. This, you know, it wasn't easy. Not at all. It wasn't painless. And yet he prayed, Not my will but yours be done.

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One thing I just love about that scene is that Jesus doesn't pretend. He doesn't put a smiley face on. No, he doesn't deny his emotions, he doesn't suppress the anguish, but he brings it honestly before the Father. And given somebody wrote down what they saw that night, he wasn't afraid to let it be seen and written about in the Word of God. And really, that's such an important picture for us. Surrender doesn't require pretending. Sometimes we may feel like we are pretending, but then it's probably not surrender yet. Right. Jesus, in the story that we're talking about right now, wasn't pretending in the Garden of Gethsemane. Surrender also isn't the absence of struggle. It's bringing our struggle into relationship with God. It's thinking his thoughts about it. It's bringing our thoughts about whatever the struggle has been into alignment with God and his thoughts. If Jesus himself experienced the cost of surrender, and we know he did from that account, perhaps we can stop being shocked, dismayed, discouraged when surrender feels so costly for us, too.

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Well, and here's the beautiful part Jesus understands. You know, he gets it when letting go feels scary. He understands. When trusting feels risky, he understands. When surrender feels costly, he gets it. He understands. He's walked this road. And you know, one of the things that helps me so much when I think about surrender when I'm struggling is I don't have to figure out how to surrender on my own. I don't have to kind of pull myself up, figure it out, make it happen. I can ask for God's help. Lord, I'm struggling. I'm having so much trouble here. Will you help me to be surrendered? Help me to have a surrendered heart. And boy, that makes all the difference.

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Maybe as we've been talking, there's something that Jesus is inviting you to loosen your grip on. So what is it that Jesus might be asking you to open your hands about, to loosen your grip on? Maybe it's food, maybe it's control, maybe it's certainty. All of those things we've been talking about. And then there's a ton more. Um, maybe you can identify with the struggle of the perfectionist, and he's calling you to lay that down. Um, maybe it's needing relief immediately. You know, I am uncomfortable, it's late at night, and I have these feelings rising up in me. And my tendency is to grab for relief right away. Perhaps

One Breath Practice And Closing Prayer

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Jesus is not standing over you or over me, hands on his hips, saying, You've got to get this down, surrender already. Right. I can't picture that. I just can't. No, no, no, no, no. Maybe instead he's standing beside you, offering himself, offering, you know, his presence, offering his faithfulness, offering his companionship, offering his strength. In our weakness, his strength is made perfect.

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Yes, perfect. Oh, that's a beautiful, beautiful picture of him standing and offering these things. I mean, that's that's who God is. That lines up with his character.

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And and here's the thing, I've just got to insert here. I'm sorry to interrupt you. No, no, go ahead. But it's like when you think about it, what if this struggle that I've had for most of my whole life with food and eating and body image and all of that, he intends to teach me that he is enough, that he wants me to lay down this struggle and experience his sufficiency, his strength, and my weakness. Maybe that's what it's for. And if I run around to all the different ideas that people throw out there for how to handle this, it's a weight problem, after all. If I run around and try to use those solutions, maybe I'm gonna miss the treasure that Jesus has for me in the midst of it, which is maybe that late night moment where I surrender my desire to fix it, to stifle it, and I turn to him.

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Because ultimately, surrender is not about losing something, it's about discovering someone, and that someone is God, and he's the one that can offer us everything we need so that we can surrender and live in that very peaceful place of trusting God. Not all the time, not perfectly. We're not worried about that part of it, but being able to experience that more and more.

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So this week we have a suggested reflection practice for you. Um, when you have an urge, rise up. Maybe you could pause for just one breath. Just one breath. That's all. And then ask and ask the Lord to show you Lord, what am I afraid will happen if I don't immediately respond to this, to this urge, to this discomfort. And then uh ask him, Jesus, would you stay with me right here? I want to stay put. I want to not move to fix this. Would you stay with me here? And and it's not to prove anything, it's not to perform, it's not to check in with your accountability buddies and say, I did it, I did it. It's just to practice trust. I will survive this moment if I don't put a boot in it.

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Oh, I love it. I'm gonna go ahead and pray. Lord Jesus, thank you that you understand surrender. Thank you that you understand fear. Thank you, Jesus, that you never ask us to trust you from a distance. Lord, you walk with us. Teach us to trust you where letting go feels vulnerable and where surrender feels frightening. Lord, help us discover that you are faithful. You are the strength of our hearts, you are our portion forever. We love you, Jesus. And I pray in your name. Amen.

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Thanks for joining us today.

SPEAKER_04 31:09

Yeah, we are so glad that you've been here today. We hope that you might join us for our next podcast episode of Revelation Within.

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We'll see you next time.